Panelists: Rob Chiarelli, Robina Ritchie-Barker, Ron Harris
Moderator: Michael Laskow
Michael:When I first started engineering, I was happy just getting the signal to move the meter and get the sound of the instrument to the tape machine… at least back in my day when we had tape machines. And then you go through an imitative stage where you spend the next year or two—if you're working constantly—where you’re going, “Oh, that's the sound that so-and-so used,” and you're intentionally going for that sound. And you’re able to do that at your will. And then you get such a great foundation that you become the master of that console and that room. And then, anything that you can think of, you can make that console do because you've mastered sound. You've mastered the physics and the art of sound. You understand that a brighter, shorter reverb is going to give you one result and a richer, longer reverb is going to give you another result. Did you find that, as well, Rob?
Rob: Yeah, I think you're right. And I think that we could actually take this to the nth degree, because it's not just engineering, and you learn the craft. But I was a musician first, so I studied classical music. I began as a percussionist, took up the Jazz Bass, went to school, studied the whole thing, and then, you know, it's almost like, after I got out of college, I had to unravel all that nonsense. You know, none of it gets placed in Pop records. Are you kidding me? I mean, a little bit, you know. But I think that if you were to look back and say, “Well, sure, we learn, we grow, we become, what's a good word, not proficient, but flexible. Yeah, that's a good word for it. So, so we become great musicians, let's just say, and then, and only then can you be free enough like Jazz players. You’ll come to understand that you learn your instrument at a high level, and then you become great at your craft and you can express yourself more easily. The idea is that we're learning from everything that came before us and then putting in our own experiences. Now, nobody hires me because I know how to turn a knob. Nobody does. They hire me because of my instincts and my feel, and I'm not right for everything. Right?
Ron: They want your perspective, and hopefully you've done it so many times, you've got Grammys. That's why they keep coming to you, because of your perspective, your uniqueness is top dog. That's just what it is.
Michael:
I guess part of it is recognizing the stages when you're going through them, where you go, “Oh, I now have that foundation.”
Rob: There's so much to learn, but it’s an evolution, too. A journey. This is a journey that's exactly this isn't a destination that we're talking about.
Robina: That's why it hurts when I hear about people who keep trying to pedal a song that they love so much, that they made years ago, and it's just all about this song. This song. Well, you know, I've got to make this song and sell this song. Well, give yourself credit. You don't let that go, but you can. There's a lot more music in you, you know? So let that go and move on. Get to the next one, and the next one. Grow, experiment, learn, stretch. That's where the fun is. That's where the fun is.
Michael:
So, it's not about how many times you fall down, it's how many times you get back up?
Robina: Absolutely, and to assume that that's the best work you ever did. How tragic is that? Let that go!
“But don't assume the one you’re stuck on is going to be the big dog. You need to feed all the puppies. You never throw any song away, because I can give you countless stories of songs that existed five years prior to becoming some of the biggest songs ever.”
Ron: Yeah, and just a little different perspective—you've got to let it go in terms of thinking that this is it! There's a term that we like to use. It's all called, “You feed all the puppies,” right? So, you feed every song you have, because you don't know which one is going to grow into the big dog. But don't assume the one you’re stuck on is going to be the big dog. You need to feed all the puppies. You never throw any song away, because I can give you countless stories of songs that existed five years prior to becoming some of the biggest songs ever. But you feed the puppies, but you just have to walk them every now and again. That's what we call songs, our little puppies. So, you just feed them, and you feed them all the same, and especially that little runt that you think that may not be anything, and that's the one that can do it for you.
“Just because you can doesn't mean you should.”
Michael: We’ve got to end this panel in a minute, but I want everybody in the room to whip out a pen and a piece of paper and write this down, and when you get home, tape it up on the wall, wherever you make your music. Let me know when you're ready. “Just because you can doesn't mean you should.” You've heard me say it on TAXI TV 1,000 times. My dad taught me that, and it's so true.
I hated mixing. I'm envious of Rob because he loves mixing and he’s so good at it. I personally love tracking. I just absolutely despised overdubbing, and mixing was a chore to me because I was a perfectionist and I didn't know when to let go of precious and, you know, you’ve got budgets and you’ve got to finish the record by a certain date. All of that forced me to learn how to mix quickly and let go of precious. But I remember the first two or three years I was doing it, I would wait for everybody to leave, and I would do exactly what you did, Rob.I’d wait for everybody to pull out of the parking lot and I'd go right back in the studio. I’d turn down the lights, take in the magical glow of the LEDs on my SSL and I’d work all night long trying to make that mix perfect. I never achieved perfection. But, just because you can doesn't mean you should. And by the way, where that's most applicable is adding more instruments and parts than you should. You don't need them! Any successful TAXI member will tell you that they make more money and get more placements with the most ridiculously simple stuff they've done, rather than the “great” stuff. People in the sync industry aren’t looking for the composer of the year. They're looking for a piece of music that solves a problem for them. And the problem is, “How do I make this scene more emotional? How do I make the action more impactful?” They're looking for music that solves a problem. By you adding this little part and that little part—I'm sure they work, they sound fine, but they're actually hurting you because simplicity always sells. We've all heard, “Keep it simple, stupid.” The K.I.S.S. principle, right? That became a thing because it's true. So just because you can, it doesn't mean you should. And as Tom will tell you, I've got another phrase that I use a lot at work when the sh*t’s hitting the fan and something is going wrong. I turn to Tom, and what do I say, Tom?
Tom [off stage]: It ain't cancer.
Michael: Right! It ain't cancer! A mix that's just not coming together in the moment or something. It's not life or death. It's a piece of music. Finish it, shove it out the door, ship it, get it over with, and move forward. Any final thoughts from you guys who've been amazing?
“I'm going to finish. I'm going to finish and send it out.”
Rob: One more thought, yes. If you happen to hear from a sync company that they want you to change two words, you'll write another song. Call it an alternate version. Make the change for God's sake, and do it quickly. Just do it! This is the music business. It's not the music hobby. If you want to have those placements, you've got to make the change, and you’ll be stunned at how many placements we've [Rob and the Highfields] had because the other guy didn't want to make a little change. Wow! It's stunning how often we have gotten a placement because the other person was unwilling to bend. Dum Dums. I mean, why? You got to do it anyway. Yeah, let's go. Let's write songs!
Michael: Any final thoughts from you, Robina?
Robina: You pretty much nailed it— just make more music. The world always wants more music, and it's where our happy zone is, right? So, if you want to get through and finish something, make a deadline, but move forward. Make more music. Grow. Have fun!
Ron: I’m just going to add, you know, it's really important, like leaving here in this moment, just make a commitment to yourself. “I'm going to finish. I'm going to finish and send it out.” Commit that to yourself. That's your only obligation. And if you can find the space to do that, you will get everything you want, not anything, but everything! You have to make that commitment to yourself, and the time is now.
Michael: Thank you, guys very much! Ron Harris, Robina Richie-Barker, and Rob Chiarelli, ladies and gentlemen!